I agree, 110% skidoo. I have tried SOOO many, and there are few that come close, especially in the bang for your buck department, keeping old machines running faster than new ones running inefficient code,, and that's why I was willing to spend the last month or two finding a way to run antix with multiple systems and convert off of SlackoPup. I felt strongly enough that I even made a smallish donation to antix, which is something I've never done for any other distro,, figuring I could support it a bit since I'm working, so could afford to, and because I'm saving a bunch of money because I can run comfortably on my old hardware without needing to replace it, which is what most Windoze folks do when their machines get slow due to MS crap code.

skidoo wrote: Howabout the antiX live-kernel-replacer tool? Ask in just about any other distro's support forum & expect to be told"no, sorry, can't be done."

Yes, that is a really cool app.

We do listen to what our users and regulars say and do think about their requests, ideas for improvements. They may be 'rejected' due to lack of time and manpower, or maybe because we feel the request is not what antiX is about e.g. openbox configured and installed.

Future improvements will include encryption option in the installer, changes to our build-iso app that we use to create our fresh isos. Unlike many spins, derivatives, antiX is not a remaster of another distro or of itslef. For example, we do not start by downloading antiX-core and building upwards in VBox. All antiX isos are built from scratch using debootstrap and our build-iso set of scripts.

We are alsp planning, based on user feedback and requests, a Unity release!

Is antiX likely to be based on Devuan in the future?

Here:

========= SCRAPER REMOVED AN EMBEDDED LINK HERE ===========
url was:"http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20161017#refracta"
linktext was:"http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue ... 7#refracta"
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"In Wicd, to the right of Refresh is a down-arrow - clicking on that will get you to Preferences dialog. In the box next to Wireless interface type"wlan0" then click OK and Refresh. You should be able to see wireless networks then."

This is often needed with Wicd in many distros.

And note what the article says, that wifi drivers must be installed manually, maybe this got fixed by now.

Shay wrote:

coyotito wrote:You did of course manually fill in wlan0 device in wicd?

Did not think of that. Got a how to link?

Yes, Devuan is still work in progress but it and refracta will be good I'm sure.

I will keep a eye on it most likely. But AntiX is my favorite.

coyotito wrote:Is antiX likely to be based on Devuan in the future?

Unlikely since Debian offers so much more especially for users who want testing/sid and nosystemd. Devuan's testing/sid is way behind at the moment.

coyotito wrote:Here:

========= SCRAPER REMOVED AN EMBEDDED LINK HERE ===========
url was:"http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20161017#refracta"
linktext was:"http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue ... 7#refracta"
====================================

"In Wicd, to the right of Refresh is a down-arrow - clicking on that will get you to Preferences dialog. In the box next to Wireless interface type"wlan0" then click OK and Refresh. You should be able to see wireless networks then."

This is often needed with Wicd in many distros.

And note what the article says, that wifi drivers must be installed manually, maybe this got fixed by now.

Yes, Devuan is still work in progress but it and refracta will be good I'm sure.

I thank you, Now to remember that.

Yes, I do believe they got past the manual wifi driver install. From what I looked at, seems real close to what is in AntiX and MX for Broadcom drivers.

Right, time for me to install refracta on some spare disk and see.
Maybe Devuan want to emphasise the stable version, this suits me as I have never used testing/sid much

wlan0 is there.
lspci -vnn -s 0c:00.0
shows the right driver.
Dell Latitude D630 laptop.

Does Devuan/refracta offer less in terms of available software?
Why could they not just build on the antiX way of avoiding systemd?
Did they want to remove even the possibility of installing it?

It is a pity if it all splinters up into poorly manned projects.

Must say systemd rubs me the wrong way though I don't mess with init files much. On my fast gaming tower (4cpu thing 8gb ram, bought used but very powerful)
Mint 18 mate takes ages to boot (search revealed its smth to do with systemd). Way faster with upstart in ub14.04.

anticapitalista wrote:

coyotito wrote:Is antiX likely to be based on Devuan in the future?

Unlikely since Debian offers so much more especially for users who want testing/sid and nosystemd. Devuan's testing/sid is way behind at the moment.

coyotito wrote:Does Devuan/refracta offer less in terms of available software?
Why could they not just build on the antiX way of avoiding systemd?
Did they want to remove even the possibility of installing it?

Debian decided that they were going to use systemd, there wasn't to be any other choice!

That is why the Devuan project was proposed & started, it was so that people could chose which boot loader they wanted on their system.

But since the Devuan project was gaining a following, Debian repented & now allows systemd free builds.
This is how AntiX is free of systemd.

Devuan is still a young project, but it is being created by ex Debian people who want to give us the choice of not having systemd forced upon us MS style.

I am investigating how ready/stable it is now by installing it on a laptop. I believe it is ready, there are just some more of the Debian packages to be checked, & if necessary, Devuanised. __{{emoticon}}__

coyotito wrote:Does Devuan/refracta offer less in terms of available software?
Why could they not just build on the antiX way of avoiding systemd?
Did they want to remove even the possibility of installing it?

It is a pity if it all splinters up into poorly manned projects.

Must say systemd rubs me the wrong way though I don't mess with init files much. On my fast gaming tower (4cpu thing 8gb ram, bought used but very powerful)
Mint 18 mate takes ages to boot (search revealed its smth to do with systemd). Way faster with upstart in ub14.04.

anticapitalista wrote:

coyotito wrote:Is antiX likely to be based on Devuan in the future?

Unlikely since Debian offers so much more especially for users who want testing/sid and nosystemd. Devuan's testing/sid is way behind at the moment.

The speed up answer for this old Dell D630 was a SSD and AntiX, 15 seconds.. MX is real close behind it.

Does Devuan/refracta offer less in terms of available software?

When your system is configured to use devuan stable repository, about 43,000 packages are available.
Of the 43K total, last I checked (about 2wks ago) around 1,013 are re-packaged (re-versioned) by devuan.
The balance (42,000 packages) are just mirrored and re-hosted copies of as-packaged-by-debian packages.

Among the 1K re-versioned devuan packages, the majority are not significantly modified.
About 300 packages have been (necessarily) modified by devuan, to remove"depends on" systemd declarations ~~ many of which are false/unnecessary (i.e., the packaged software will, in fact, still run perfectly in the absence of systemd stack). To date, per my cursory investigation, only about 170 packages have been significantly reworked (recoded, to avoid dependence on systemd) by devuan or created-from-scratch by devuan.

Actually, I'm unaware of any created-from-scratch, by devuan, packages. Chime in if you know of any.
Devuan hasn't even repurposed or re-written the package(s) necessary to support live-boot.

The numbers/totals provide a degree of perspective, but the devil's in the details. For instance, the antiX packages
========= SCRAPER REMOVED AN EMBEDDED LINK HERE ===========
url was:"https://github.com/antiX-Linux"
linktext was:"https://github.com/antiX-Linux"
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"antix-goodies" and"persist-scripts" provide a slew of value-added functionality, multiple custom-coded utilities and programs. That, I believe, is what you should consider, in terms of assessing"more (or less) in terms of available software". Said differently: the value-add provided by antiX is clearly evident to me, vs... I'm scratching my head trying to understand, comparatively, what is devuan's value proposition?

Why could they not just build on the antiX way of avoiding systemd?

What? From my perspective, their"way of avoiding systemd" is essentially identical.
Both are employing apt-pinning to preclude installation of systemd* packages.
The primary difference is that antix doesn't fudge, doesn't claim credit for providing (from own repo) 42,000 packaged-by-debian packages. If and when a given package available from debian repos"goes south", antiX/MX devs step in and provide an alternative package (hosted and served from antiX and/or MX repos).

Did they want to remove even the possibility of installing it?

Someone else might refute/clarify this statement but, per my hands-on tinkering/investigation, both devuan and antiX employ equally effective, and nearly identical, measures to preclude the possibility of"installing systemd".

In contrast, MX is a standout -- its repos aren't serving"bastardized" repackaged programs, intended to be incompatible with / unsuitable for a machine on which systemd is installed. The MX ethos of preserving user choice (freedom to shoot self in foot then limp into emergency room / support forum) is commendable, IMO, but I suspect neither the devuan devs nor the antiX devs (nor participants in their respective user-to-user support forums) are up to the chore of supporting a stack they're not using on a day-to-day basis.

Is antiX currently serving any repackaged programs, packages which have been"doctored" primarily with intent to be incompatible a machine on which systemd is installed? If so, I can't cite any. AFAIK, the antiX-supplied packages represent necessary replacements/alternatives. Devuan, in contrast, seems to bent on being systemd incompatible ~~ several of the"essential/base" packages in devuan repos are already incompatible (perhaps necessarily so) and, referring back to that 1,013 number mentioned earlier in this post, those are all"earmarked" by devuan (queued for sooner-rather-than-later"doctoring").

I understand the devuan collective voice to be"All this stuffs worked perfectly fine prior to the advent of systemd. We're intent on preserving that status quo." Whelp... good luck with THAT. I'm a pragmatist, not an idealist. My forward-looking goal is one of resilience, avoiding lock-in.

Thanks! My questions were perhaps dumb but great answers.
Now to try refracta, got a 2.5 64 gb SSD here.

Refracta still has the wifi issue, on this eeepc 1000H I had to install ralink driver manually.

Adding wlan0 in Wicd has nothing to do with the driver being present or not, it just needs to be filled in -which it was..

Seems everything works. Pulseaudio was not installed, I need that for bluetooth headset to work.

Had to give up on antiX and MX with this machine, prob with audio/bluetooth. 1st distro where everything worked was Salix 14.2 but for some reason sound quality was not good.
Intel chips can be tricky.