I've got a dual boot laptop with Ubuntu Hardy/XP. And I have a backup HD which in the past I have formatted with two partitions--an ext3 & an NTFS--for backing up the internal drive. But actually mine is an older laptop--celeron 433 mhz processor and 256 Ram--and I want to put a nice, fast, small distro like AntiX on the external drive to experiment with. At the same time, I'd like to have that drive be available for backing up my main drive's dual boot (Ubuntu/XP). I've just written zero's to the external drive, and am ready to partition it.

I asked someone what will be the best setup of that drive for it to fulfill its new dual role as bootup disk for a tiny linux os and also backup drive for my dual boot.

They answered:

Personally , now that I know how to partition, I like to keep the data separate from the OS. so I say a"small" ext3 partition for the OS, a swap partition, and a data partition.

The data partition could be Ext3 or NTFS, not sure it makes much difference. Of the two I would go with NTFS.

I think their idea sounds like a very good one, and I'd like to do it. But never done manual partitioning before and every time I get to the partitioning section of an Ubuntu setup, it never looks very clear. Could someone tell me how it is done, or point me to a very good and clear HowTo.

Also: Can AntiX keep its Home folder (if that is what it is called) on a separate partition which is of type NTFS? Will I be able to write all my Linux data ie AntiX as well as Ubuntu data, to the NTFS partition?

I will assume you are using the latest release 7.2. Gparted comes on the CD and will help you partition your drive. --/menu/settings/config-system/gparted

You should create 3 partitions on your drive:

sd?1=3-5g for /
sd?2=What ever you need for /home
sd?3=the rest for your backups of the other drives
Your existing /swap will be used automatically I believe

The installer will see these partitions and allow you to select them for the install. When you get to grub, install it to /root and edit your existing /boot/grub/menu to reflect AntiX. The rest should be straight forward but ask if you need.

eriefisher

[edit]you should format the drive ext3 for"/" and"/home" but the back up partition should be"NTFS" so windows can use it as well. Antix will see and be able to write to the back up partition as well[edit/]

You may want to read through this:
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I am also trying to figure out a good partitioning scheme to share data between distro's and this was a great help to me!

eriefisher wrote:I will assume you are using the latest release 7.2. Gparted comes on the CD and will help you partition your drive. --/menu/settings/config-system/gparted

Yes, I am using 7.2. And I have Parted Magic as well, for partitioning if needed. No problems there.

eriefisher wrote:You should create 3 partitions on your drive:

sd?1=3-5g for /
sd?2=What ever you need for /home
sd?3=the rest for your backups of the other drives
Your existing /swap will be used automatically I believe

[edit]you should format the drive ext3 for"/" and"/home" but the back up partition should be"NTFS" so windows can use it as well. Antix will see and be able to write to the back up partition as well[edit/]

I see, so the home folder of AntiX needs to be in its own separate partition from the backup data? How about if I were to make one NTFS partition for all the data. Since AntiX can write to NTFS, wouldn't that work? That would just free me from having to designate a certain amount of space when I'm not really sure how much I'll need. Would it work then, for me to have just two partitions-- one for */* and the other for all my data?

Also, how large does the"/" partition need to be? (That is where AntiX OS gets installed, right?)

eriefisher wrote:The installer will see these partitions and allow you to select them for the install. When you get to grub, install it to /root and edit your existing /boot/grub/menu to reflect AntiX. The rest should be straight forward but ask if you need.

I was also consdering the possibility of testing out some other small distros like Tinyflux, Tinyme, Fluxbuntu. Do you think they vary enough from AntiX to be worth trying out? And if so, how many distros can grub comfortably accomodate these days? When I was learning about it a year ago, anything more than two was complex.

Side question: One of the main reasons for my interest in looking at several small distros, is to see if there is a difference in (1) speed, (2) my ability to configure ndiswrapper for my netgear dongle on it (will it be the same procedure I did in Ubuntu?) (3) ability to install Kexi (KDE Database utility) and SCIM (language input utility), (4) ability to use Remote Desktop.

I see, so the home folder of AntiX needs to be in its own separate partition from the backup data? How about if I were to make one NTFS partition for all the data. Since AntiX can write to NTFS, wouldn't that work? That would just free me from having to designate a certain amount of space when I'm not really sure how much I'll need. Would it work then, for me to have just two partitions-- one for */* and the other for all my data?

Also, how large does the"/" partition need to be? (That is where AntiX OS gets installed, right?)

You could just use one partition for antix, say 5-10g and keep /home in /root to save space and headaches. Just save file to the NTFS aprtition if you need. Antix should install on about 3g without issue but I would not install Linux on an NTFS partition.

I was also consdering the possibility of testing out some other small distros like Tinyflux, Tinyme, Fluxbox. Do you think they vary enough from AntiX to be worth trying out? And if so, how many distros can grub comfortably accomodate these days? When I was learning about it a year ago, anything more than two was complex.

Side question: One of the main reasons for my interest in looking at several small distros, is to see if there is a difference in (1) speed, (2) my ability to configure ndiswrapper for my netgear dongle on it (will it be the same procedure I did in Ubuntu?) (3) ability to install Kexi (KDE Database utility) and SCIM (language input utility), (4) ability to use Remote Desktop.

What I would do is create several small partitions, one for each distro you want to try out. When you have decided, just delete the partitions. --OR-- you could install vitualbox and install several distros inside what you have, no need for more partions.

eriefisher

eriefisher wrote:You could just use one partition for antix, say 5-10g and keep /home in /root to save space and headaches. Just save file to the NTFS aprtition if you need. Antix should install on about 3g without issue but I would not install Linux on an NTFS partition.

I didn't understand earlier that by"g" you meant GB. I have to tell you that my HD is only 10 GB in size. That is why I asked how much space the AntiX distro itself needs. I thought the OS was small. Ubuntu only takes up around 3 GB I think, and it must be quite a bit larger than AntiX. I should only need as much space in that partition as the AntiX OS itself will take up, right? Or I guess, the programs will also be located there? So if I dedicate 1 GB to it would that be enough? What would be the absolute minimum needed, and what would be a figure that takes into account the sort of basic software I need (AbiWord, SCIM, Kexi, WebBrowser, basic email, simple sound and video).

eriefisher wrote:

I was also consdering the possibility of testing out some other small distros like Tinyflux, Tinyme, Fluxbuntu.....

What I would do is create several small partitions, one for each distro you want to try out. When you have decided, just delete the partitions. --OR-- you could install vitualbox and install several distros inside what you have, no need for more partions.

If I create several small partitions, one for each distro, will Grub be able to manage all those distros? Or, how will I configure a boot-up menu for them? I thought a bootup menu with more than two distros was quite complex? Or, what did you have in mind when you said to create several small partitions one for each distro. How will the boot work?

I just did a df -h in a terminal and it shows the installed size of Antix as 1.9gb but if you want to actually use the OS and keep files etc. you will need more space.

As for grub, I once read and article that someone had grub booting like 60 different OS's and not all of them were Linux. But because of your limited space I would install Virtualbox in either Windows or Ubuntu just to test them all and then install the winnner(AntiX) once you have decided.

eriefisher

1. Where does AntiX locate itself on the scale from the smallest, fastest distro to the largest, most full-featured distro? Is it on the small side, or is it in the middle somewhere? I was thinking that an OS that requires 2 GB just for the OS is not a"small" OS.

Are other distros which are considered as small such as Tinyflux, Tinyme, puppy linux, Fluxbuntu, or others I may not be aware of-- are these smaller? Or is AntiX right in there among the smallest ones?

Is AntiX known for one of the distros that runs well on older hardware?

2. As for partitions, is there some way that I could have all my data (AntiX home + other HD backup data) in one partition, and the AntiX OS in the other partition? It seems like that would give me both security of data, and flexibility in sizing. I could make the OS partition 3g, and the data OS 7g. That 7g OS could be either ext3, Fat32, or NTFS-- whichever would best accomodate the collective needs of AntiX, Ubuntu, and XP. If I have to further divide into two separate data partitions, then I'll have to think very carefully how to do it. And then, I'm sorry did you say the AntiX install will create the swap partiition, during the install process, so I don't need to create it in gparted? But it will ask me how big to make it, won't it? So how large a swap should I make?

1-I'm not sure how Antix compares in installed size to the others you mention but it will install on as little as a PII and be fairly quick on it. Anything with buntu in it's name probably will be slower. One thing Antix doesn't have is all the point and click configuration tools, although the new Antix CC comes close. You have to configure your system manually which will force you to learn Linux.

2.Because you need to use the backup partition for windows, it must be formated NTFS. You could have just a 2gb partition for Antix and place /home inside of it then mount the NTFS partition inside /home. This would leave the rest of the disc for storage (8GB). Windows will not read the ext3 file system but Linux can read/write to a NTFS system. As far as a /swap partition, you should already have one for ubuntu. When you install Antix you should be able to select it or none and when you reboot the existing /swap should be detected.

I don't think you can install Linux on a NTFS disc or at least you shouldn't.

eriefisher

eriefisher wrote:1. [...]One thing Antix doesn't have is all the point and click configuration tools, although the new Antix CC comes close. You have to configure your system manually which will force you to learn Linux.

Could you say very briefly in lay English what you mean by"configure your system". Once AntiX is installed, just what is it that I am going to have to configure manually, for example?

eriefisher wrote:2.Because you need to use the backup partition for windows, it must be formated NTFS. You could have just a 2gb partition for Antix and place /home inside of it then mount the NTFS partition inside /home. This would leave the rest of the disc for storage (8GB).

I have decided not to backup my XP partition anymore. The small bit of personal data I have there is already backed up somewhere else, and I won't be creating any new personal data there.

So let's say I only need to back up my Ubuntu Hardy home folder onto this drive. I'd like to learn to put the AntiX home folder in a separate partition from the OS. (I assume the Ubunty Hardy home folder could later simply be backed up up into the same partition where the AntiX home folder is.) That gives me 3 partitions: the"/", AntiX home, and a swap. So on a 10g HD, would you say 2g is enough for the Antix"/" partition, or should I make it 2.5 to be safe, or would 3g be better?

eriefisher wrote:Windows will not read the ext3 file system but Linux can read/write to a NTFS system.

I thought there was a way to make Windows read ext3. It isn't so?

eriefisher wrote:As far as a /swap partition, you should already have one for ubuntu. When you install Antix you should be able to select it or none and when you reboot the existing /swap should be detected.

This 10g HD currently has nothing on it. I've just written zeros to the drive, and the first thing I will be putting on it is AntiX. So I need to make the /swap partition. There isn't going to be any /swap partition already existing. My Ubuntu and XP are on a completely separate HD.

So in this scenario, should I use gparted to divide the 10g HD into three partitions: an ext3 for the AntiX"/"; an ext3 for Antix home folder (and I'll also eventually put a backup of my Ubuntu home folder here), and a /swap. Or do I not even need to use garted for this, and can create these three partitions using the AntiX installer?

How large should the swap partition be? Is there a rule of thumb for this?

Could you say very briefly in lay English what you mean by"configure your system". Once AntiX is installed, just what is it that I am going to have to configure manually, for example?

You may not want to do anything but if you do there is no point and click system like Gnome or KDE. You will have to edit text files to achieve you goal(easy though).

So let's say I only need to back up my Ubuntu Hardy home folder onto this drive. I'd like to learn to put the AntiX home folder in a separate partition from the OS. (I assume the Ubunty Hardy home folder could later simply be backed up up into the same partition where the AntiX home folder is.) That gives me 3 partitions: the"/", AntiX home, and a swap. So on a 10g HD, would you say 2g is enough for the Antix"/" partition, or should I make it 2.5 to be safe, or would 3g be better?

If this is the case I would create three partitions"/""/home""/data". Make your"/" 2gb,"/home" 1-2gb and use the rest for"/data" to use for Antix and Ubuntu. You Ubuntu install must have a /swap somewhere. Even if it is on another disc apart from Antix it will be detected.

I thought there was a way to make Windows read ext3. It isn't so?

I think there is a driver to allow use of the ext3 partition for windows but I believe it's experimental.

This 10g HD currently has nothing on it. I've just written zeros to the drive, and the first thing I will be putting on it is AntiX. So I need to make the /swap partition. There isn't going to be any /swap partition already existing. My Ubuntu and XP are on a completely separate HD.

/swap does not have to be on the same drive. You only need one /swap for all OS's install. If the installer does not see it then select none and it should be recognized on bootup and be used.

Again, you Ubuntu install must have a /swap. It would have been created during it's install.

eriefisher

eriefisher wrote:If this is the case I would create three partitions"/""/home""/data". Make your"/" 2gb,"/home" 1-2gb and use the rest for"/data" to use for Antix and Ubuntu. You Ubuntu install must have a /swap somewhere. Even if it is on another disc apart from Antix it will be detected.

1. Could you just say a few words about why it is better not to have AntiX home and the Ubuntu backup home folder in the same partition? You seem to feel it is clearly better to keep the Antix home and the Ubuntu backup data in separate partitions.

At least to my naive understanding, it just seems like it keeps it simple to have them in the same partition and minimizes my need to predesignate specific amounts to each beforehand. But if there is a benefit to doing as you say, then I want to understand why. And I'll do it that way.

2. I think I didn't explain clearly before, but my two HD's will not be present at the same time in my computer. This is an older laptop with only one HD bay. So when this 10g HD with AntiX is in the laptop, at that time my Ubuntu HD will not be there. It will be removed, sitting peacefully in my desk drawer. So I need to create a swap partition.

I currently have a HD with zeros written to it. Do I need to use gparted to create all the respective partitions (including swap) before starting the AntiX installer, or will the AntiXinstaller itself have an option for manual creation of partitions and designating which is for"/", which is for"/home", which is for"/data" (if it is really needed to be separate), and which is for"/swap".

1. Could you just say a few words about why it is better not to have AntiX home and the Ubuntu backup home folder in the same partition? You seem to feel it is clearly better to keep the Antix home and the Ubuntu backup data in separate partitions.

I like to keep my data and the OS separate. This way I can reinstall or change OS's without affecting my own data. You could just use the rest of the drive for /home but you will have more work should you decide to change OS's. It will work without issue though.

2. I think I didn't explain clearly before, but my two HD's will not be present at the same time in my computer. This is an older laptop with only one HD bay. So when this 10g HD with AntiX is in the laptop, at that time my Ubuntu HD will not be there. It will be removed, sitting peacefully in my desk drawer. So I need to create a swap partition.

Sorry I assumed it was and external drive ie:usb. In this case you will need"/""/home" and"/swap". The installer does give you the option of running the partitioner or you can run it before hand via the menu to set things up. If you do it this way you have to select"custom install to existing partitions".

The size of /swap depends on the amount of ram you have. Usually 1-1.5 times the amount of ram installed. If you have a lot of ram, you could make the /swap smaller.

Antix is pretty easy on the ram. I have a Celeron 466 with 190mb of ram and a 256mb /swap and it is almost never used.

eriefisher

eriefisher wrote:

1. Could you just say a few words about why it is better not to have AntiX home and the Ubuntu backup home folder in the same partition?...

I like to keep my data and the OS separate. This way I can reinstall or change OS's without affecting my own data. You could just use the rest of the drive for /home but you will have more work should you decide to change OS's. It will work without issue though.

Ah, NOW I understand. Yes, what you say makes perfect sense. I was wrongly thinking before, that data is data whether it is my Ubuntu backup data or the AntiX home folder. But you are right I see, in categorizing the AntiX home folder as part of the OS, since if you remove AntiX then you will no longer need the AntiX home folder.

But wait a minute, one question has just come in my mind on this: You said"You could just use the rest of the drive for /home but you will have more work should you decide to change OS's." But if I were to want to remove AntiX, couldn't I just delete the AntiX home folder from the data partition? What would be the big deal about that? Why would it be less work, or easier to do, if the AntiX home folder were in a separate partition from the rest of my data? In one case I'd be deleting the home folder from within the general data partition, and in the other case I'd be deleting the home folder along with the actual partition which was dedicated for it. Is there any special difference in those two things?

And for that matter, if I install five different distros on the HD, why couldn't I keep all of their home folders in the same ext3 data partition along with my backup data from the other HD? Is there a problem in doing that? Does each OS's home folder need to be in a separate partition from the other OS's home folders?

eriefisher wrote:

2. I think I didn't explain clearly before, but my two HD's will not be present at the same time in my computer. This is an older laptop with only one HD bay. So when this 10g HD with AntiX is in the laptop, at that time my Ubuntu HD will not be there. It will be removed, sitting peacefully in my desk drawer. So I need to create a swap partition.

Sorry I assumed it was an external drive ie:usb.

I do have a PCMCIA connecter which connects any laptop HD up externally, yes. But I usually just hook that up when I want to backup data from my internal HD to an external HD. Otherwise, whatever HD I want to boot to I put inside the laptop as the internal HD. And the other HD sleeps in my drawer unless I need to backup data, in which case I hook it up via PCMCIA.

Do you think it may be possible for me to boot up my computer using the external PCMCIA linked HD? I thought the PCMCIA drivers would only become active once the OS is running.

eriefisher wrote:In this case you will need"/""/home" and"/swap". The installer does give you the option of running the partitioner or you can run it before hand via the menu to set things up. If you do it this way you have to select"custom install to existing partitions".

The size of /swap depends on the amount of ram you have. Usually 1-1.5 times the amount of ram installed. If you have a lot of ram, you could make the /swap smaller.

Antix is pretty easy on the ram. I have a Celeron 466 with 190mb of ram and a 256mb /swap and it is almost never used.

My laptop is a Celeron 433 mhz with Ram 256mb. So the /swap should be around 375mb?

If you have the /home in the root partition it keeps all of your configs and settings with it. So when you delete root you delete your /home (because they are in one partition) and then upon re-installation would have to redo all of your configurations. If you have the /home in a separate partition you can delete the root partition and reinstall the OS without touching /home. So when you install the new root and point it to your already configured /home you will have a system that is more configured to your preference.